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Everybody can’t just mix in top 50 recruits. The 4 teams in the final 4 are 3 of the bluest of blue bloods. And Villanova is the most successful team in the last 10-15 years. Villanova is doing exactly what you said won’t work. And the other 3 can do whatever they want. We aren’t the other 3. If we don’t develop some kids, we will have some lean years in the mix.After watching this tourney, I 100% believe you have to mix in top 50 recruits and experienced transfers. For the top programs it’s almost a waste of a scholarship to have players you “hope” develop. I wish him luck and think he’ll be a good player but just not a fit for what we need right now.
So are you saying don't sign Bruner or Gurley and give those minutes to Tchikou, Hylton and Holt so that they develop?If we don’t develop some kids, we will have some lean years in the mix.
No. I’m saying we can’t 100% depend on transfers and highly ranked recruits. They are a necessity but they can’t be all of it. What happens when you miss on too many of them? You need kids on the roster that you are developing that will be there. There have to be kids that fit the system in some way and are developed in other ways to become more complete players and help. It’s a process.So are you saying don't sign Bruner or Gurley and give those minutes to Tchikou, Hylton and Holt so that they develop?
Unless I missed somebody Miles and Bediako are the only two freshmen Oats has signed that remain on this team. Given what Gurley and Bruner provided it would be interesting to see where we'd be heading into next season with a more experienced Hylton, Tchikou, and Holt. However, there is no guarantee that they'd still hang around. Would like to see what the avg amount of turnover is in SEC programs right now.No. I’m saying we can’t 100% depend on transfers and highly ranked recruits. They are a necessity but they can’t be all of it. What happens when you miss on too many of them? You need kids on the roster that you are developing that will be there. There have to be kids that fit the system in some way and are developed in other ways to become more complete players and help. It’s a process.
I can go back and forth on this all day. College Basketball has completely changed between the Transfer portal and NIL. The idea that you think kids will “stay” to develop all 4 years especially players that ride the bench is crazy. They know now if they aren’t getting playing time to just transfer to where they can, and build their brand. I actually love the way Oats is going about this. Recruit a few top HS players (miller,Bradley) and then hit the transfer portal for your experience.Everybody can’t just mix in top 50 recruits. The 4 teams in the final 4 are 3 of the bluest of blue bloods. And Villanova is the most successful team in the last 10-15 years. Villanova is doing exactly what you said won’t work. And the other 3 can do whatever they want. We aren’t the other 3. If we don’t develop some kids, we will have some lean years in the mix.
This is the dark side of the free agency portal that some of us tried to point out. There will soon be no place in competitive Div 1 athletics for the kid that can grow into a good to great player in 3 or 4 years or who simply wants the full college experience at one school. Either the kid is crazy good and is gone to the pro leagues asap or within a couple years he's encouraged to find playing time somewhere else.After watching this tourney, I 100% believe you have to mix in top 50 recruits and experienced transfers. For the top programs it’s almost a waste of a scholarship to have players you “hope” develop. I wish him luck and think he’ll be a good player but just not a fit for what we need right now.
Tell Jay Wright about that.I can go back and forth on this all day. College Basketball has completely changed between the Transfer portal and NIL. The idea that you think kids will “stay” to develop all 4 years especially players that ride the bench is crazy. They know now if they aren’t getting playing time to just transfer to where they can, and build their brand. I actually love the way Oats is going about this. Recruit a few top HS players (miller,Bradley) and then hit the transfer portal for your experience.
You have to use the portal. But at some point, you have to retain a couple kids that can help in some way as a freshman and develop them. If you can do that with 1-2 kids a year, then it would help a ton in the long run. Not every kid will jump ship. Villanova has been doing it for years with a huge portion of their roster. So surely we can figure out 1-2 kids a year.Unless I missed somebody Miles and Bediako are the only two freshmen Oats has signed that remain on this team. Given what Gurley and Bruner provided it would be interesting to see where we'd be heading into next season with a more experienced Hylton, Tchikou, and Holt. However, there is no guarantee that they'd still hang around. Would like to see what the avg amount of turnover is in SEC programs right now.
He also has a couple guys using a bonus Covid year, including Gillespie the rock solid point guard that is mentally on another planet than just about any college PG..Tell Jay Wright about that.
I hate to see that. I think he could have developed into a solid player for us. I feel the same about Tchikou.is in the portal.
Holt was ~37-38% three point shooter in high school and was signed to do the same at Bama. He shot something like 19% last season. Yes, 19%.is in the portal.
To be fair to holt, he didn’t exactly get the “shoot to get hot shoot to stay hot” treatment. I would guess less than 25 attempts on the season. However, ATLEAST 10 air balls.Holt was ~37-38% three point shooter in high school and was signed to do the same at Bama. He shot something like 19% last season. Yes, 19%.
Holt was ~37-38% three point shooter in high school and was signed to do the same at Bama. He shot something like 19% last season. Yes, 19%.
At least 10 air balls even though his shots were relatively open looks.To be fair to holt, he didn’t exactly get the “shoot to get hot shoot to stay hot” treatment. I would guess less than 25 attempts on the season. However, ATLEAST 10 air balls.
He doesn’t need much leeway. They are the standard right now and people don’t even realize it.He also has a couple guys using a bonus Covid year, including Gillespie the rock solid point guard that is mentally on another planet than just about any college PG..
Also, Wright has the leeway to maybe have a rebuild year or 2 while he develops talent. In the current climate in college and pro athletics, new coaches have pressure to win big within 3 years and developmental players aren’t exactly the path to instant success… A top recruiting class mixed with experienced guys out of the portal, while not guaranteed, is more likely to produce instant results.
The good thing about the portal is you do get a lot of guys that have 2-3 years left and are locked in once they have used their free transfer. So that element can still be there. I’m pretty sure a few of the guys we are in on in the portal have 3 years remaining. I think that’s the best of both worlds
I don’t completely disagree with your points just think coaches have a lot of pressure to win now and don’t get the time to build a culture and develop project recruits anymore. So many of the best programs right now have 15-20+ year head coaches and a lot of them didn’t have immediate success. Hell some didn’t reach their current level in their first decade+.
Oh they are. Jay Wright may be the best in the game. My point, 5 years to win regular season conference, 8 years to get to first final 4, 15 to win first championship. Just saying, it’s not instantHe doesn’t need much leeway. They are the standard right now and people don’t even realize it.
I’m not asking for instant. It’s nice. I’m good with improvement. And the right culture year after year.Oh they are. Jay Wright may be the best in the game. My point, 5 years to win regular season conference, 8 years to get to first final 4, 15 to win first championship. Just saying, it’s not instant
Coach K's record the first three years at Duke:
17-13
10-17
11-17
He didn’t know how to put his players in position to succeed. Failed to adjust his entire system to fit his current playersCoach K's record the first three years at Duke:
17-13
10-17
11-17
Oh boy. Here we go.He didn’t know how to put his players in position to succeed. Failed to adjust his entire system to fit his current players
That is before Duke booster’s started writing big checks. And Coach K was still unable to intimidate officials.Coach K's record the first three years at Duke:
17-13
10-17
11-17
It's funny that I used Coach K's record after 4-5 years as my point about keeping Avery and all anyone said was Coach Johnson isn't Coach K and never will be.Coach K's record the first three years at Duke:
17-13
10-17
11-17
Me too. I really would. But like I said above the landscape is changing. Top players out of high school like Holt (#81 overall) now want immediate playing time and don't want to take the time to develop. So, I feel like coaches are adapting to this and changing their expectation when they sign top rated kids. Live up to the expectations or I'll find someone else who can. Most players have become completely impatient when it comes to playing time so why shouldn't coaches adjust their expectations as well?I hate to see players transfer out, especially if they are being asked to leave to make room for “better” players.
I would like to see players you recruited to your program being allowed to grow.
Bc maybe Holt could help us next year? Maybe he’s stay 3-4 years and develop and become a really good player. You don’t need ever last guy on scholarship to be some elite guy, that’s when they all leave. If Holt left on his own, I get it. If he was pushed out, I don’t.Me too. I really would. But like I said above the landscape is changing. Top players out of high school like Holt (#81 overall) now want immediate playing time and don't want to take the time to develop. So, I feel like coaches are adapting to this and changing their expectation when they sign top rated kids. Live up to the expectations or I'll find someone else who can. Most players have become completely impatient when it comes to playing time so why shouldn't coaches adjust their expectations as well?
I don’t disagree with this. I think Avery struggles as a coach, but the excitement he brought along with recruiting was a shot in the arm to the program.It's funny that I used Coach K's record after 4-5 years as my point about keeping Avery and all anyone said was Coach Johnson isn't Coach K and never will be.
Alabama won an NCAA Tournament game for the first time in 12 years under Avery and Bama fires him the following season. Alabama wins the SEC under Oats, thanks largely to players Avery brought in. I was one of the posters calling for CAJ to be let go after the NIT loss, but maybe he should get more credit for pointing this Alabama program in the right direction than fans give him.
Yeah, and that's the big unknown. Again, personally, I don't like all of this transfer in/out stuff. I'd prefer Oats field a team of predominantly 'Bama guys' who have been with the program for at least 2-3 years. But the landscape has changed as these kids expect immediate playing but don't necessarily won't to work for it. I don't know if this was the case with Holt. I'm just speaking in generalities here. .If Holt left on his own, I get it. If he was pushed out, I don’t.
Grant has been unlucky. He had a team at Dayton that looked like a Final Four team, but COVID shut the season down. I think he's a better coach than Avery but his personality is so dry that he misses out on recruits he could have.I don’t disagree with this. I think Avery struggles as a coach, but the excitement he brought along with recruiting was a shot in the arm to the program.
I really thought Grant could’ve become a long term successful coach at Bama but I swear he is the least lucky coach in sports history
That was the latest example in a string of bad luck in his career.Grant has been unlucky. He had a team at Dayton that looked like a Final Four team, but COVID shut the season down. I think he's a better coach than Avery but his personality is so dry that he misses out on recruits he could have.
i would have liked grant as an assistant coach. he does not seem to be cut out as a head coach. he does seem to be a great guy.Grant has been unlucky. He had a team at Dayton that looked like a Final Four team, but COVID shut the season down. I think he's a better coach than Avery but his personality is so dry that he misses out on recruits he could have.
I disagree with him not being cut out as a HC. That makes little sense to me considering he won at the level good enough to be the hot hire when Alabama took him from VCU. He won 20+ games three seasons in a row at Alabama and he had one of the favorites to get to the Final Four at Dayton.i would have liked grant as an assistant coach. he does not seem to be cut out as a head coach. he does seem to be a great guy.
Yeah not sure if Holt was asked to leave or chose to leave. Can't blame him if he wants out. Had to be frustrating for him to watch JD get so many more minutes in front of him constantly turning the ball over and consistently lost on defense. While Holt struggled offensively I thought he was one of our better defensive guards.Bc maybe Holt could help us next year? Maybe he’s stay 3-4 years and develop and become a really good player. You don’t need ever last guy on scholarship to be some elite guy, that’s when they all leave. If Holt left on his own, I get it. If he was pushed out, I don’t.